Live Oak Growth Rates   tuce-@msn.com
  Feb 05, 2007 09:12 PST 

Ents,

... Ruskin Oak

I also noticed that some of the Live Oaks I've been measuring are on
this list from 1934, so I can compare the CBH from then to the present!
This is quite interesting. One Oak for example, in Ocean Springs, The
Ruskin Oak, measured 17'6" CBH in 1934. It now measures 27'2" CBH. That's
almost a 10' Cbh growth in 73 years! Neil this gives us a good
estimation of growth rates from this time span! There are some Oaks in
Long Beach on the list with CBH in 1934, I'm going to go measure them
and get some more comparisons. This is way cool stuff! 

Larry   
RE: Live Oaks   Edward Frank
  Feb 05, 2007 16:04 PST 

Larry, ENTS,

These seem like reasonable growth numbers for this particular tree.
Comparing the two circumferences you get a radius of 2.803 in 1934, and
a radius of 4.325 in 2007. That works out to a change in radius of
1.525 feet in 73 years or 0.2507 inches per year of radial growth.



This compares well to the sample Neil Perderson dated for Larry a few
weeks ago. With a 4' 2" diameter tree being 134 years old. Which is
0.187 inches radial growth per year on average throughout the entire
life of the tree. So a growth rate of 1/4" per year for a larger tree
is entirely reasonable.

Ed Frank
Live Oak Growth Rates   tuce-@msn.com
  Mar 05, 2007 05:32 PST 

ENTS,    
                                                             

The Friendship Oak, is located at University of Southern Ms., in Long
Beach. The tree was measured and registered with the Live Oak Society in
1934, CBH-14'7". In 2007 it measured CBH-23' a 9'7" difference. We have
the Ruskin Oak growth rates and we have the Friendship Oak growth rates
for this 73 year period! 

 

The Ruskin Oak grows on a small hillside, while
the Friendship Oak grows near the beach. It had about 15' of water under
it during Hurricane Katrina in 2006 and about the same from Hurricane
Camille in 1969. I'm sure it has been under several more times in its
300-400 year life! My point is one tree has not been flooded with
saltwater, while the other has. 

It will be interesting to compare the
different grow rates from these two different locations and the effect
of saltwater intrusion! Ed, help me out, what is the radial growth of
the Friendship Oak? Bob, we almost had a 40'-CBH Live Oak, 

I just sent Ed Frank some photos of the 37' CBH E. O. Hunt Live Oak in 
Long Beach, Ms.

Larry
Re: Live Oak Project   dbhg-@comcast.net
  Mar 05, 2007 09:55 PST 
Larry,

   The 23-foot CBH equates to a radius of 23/pi/2 = 3.66 ft

    The 14'7" CBH equates to a radius of 14.58/pi/2 = 2.32 ft

    In 73 years the radius increased 3.66 - 2.32 = 1.34 ft . This represents an expansion of 0.18 feet per year.

    0.018 feet/yr * 12 inches/per foot = 0.22 inches/year or a little under a quarter of an inch per year. That is might respectable growing.

  
Bob
Live Oak Project   tuce-@msn.com
  Mar 07, 2007 13:35 PST 

ENTS,                                                                 
I wrote about comparing growth rates of Live Oaks on a previous posting,
so far I have, will your help discovered that Live Oaks seem to grow at
about .25-.187 inches per year! One interesting thing is even with
saltwater intrusion, there is no difference in the growth rates. The
Friendship Oak being the tree under several times and the Ruskin Oak
never underwater, yet both trees have almost the same growth rates. The
Friendship Oak had .22 inches of growth per year since 1934 and th
Ruskin Oak had .25. Conclusion saltwater intrusion has almost no effect
on this species, and that Live Oak trees grow about a quarter inch per
year!   Larry        
Re: Live Oak Project   Edward Frank
  Mar 09, 2007 05:32 PST 

Larry,

I would not jump to the conclusion that the saltwater has no effect. It
might be small. One effect that might occur would be for a period of slower
growth immediately after the inundation. If it was say a year in length for
example that would show on a cross-section or a core, but would affect the
average growth rate for only a few thousandth of an inch. Maybe there are
some signs in the slice you sent to Neil - had it ever been underwater or
was it just affected by hurricanes?

Excellent job in the project. Now you are starting tog get info from other
people in other states. There are a nice series of photos from the Sire Oak
in Columbia, SC by Maracas Houtchings.

Ed
RE: Live Oak Project   tuce-@msn.com
  Mar 09, 2007 08:36 PST 

Ed,                                                                   
The sample I sent Neil had minor grow ring differences, that may have
not been caused by flooding. The sample had been under numerous times
from Hurricanes from the last 140 years or so. What we could do is check
the records of Hurricanes and compare them with the corresponding ring
growth.   What I'm saying it causes almost no effect. I'll study more
samples and I'll try to get Neil to respond on this, he's the expert.
Neil what do you say?   
Live Oak Growth Rates   tuce-@msn.com
  Mar 14, 2007 09:55 PST 

Bob,ENTS                                                              I
have another math problem for you. What is that formula for anual growth
rates? My Grandfather planted 2 Live Oaks on his property in 1962. They
are now 9' CBH, what is the growth rate per year? This will show another
example of Live Oak growth rates in 45 years for our Live Oak Project!   
Larry
Re: Live Oak Growth Rates   dbhg-@comcast.net
  Mar 14, 2007 10:09 PST 
Larry,

   A 9-ft CBH corresponds to a diameter of 9/3.141593 = 2.865 feet. This represents a radial increase of:

   2.865/2 = 1.432 feet that has occurred over a 45 year period. The annual radial increase is then:

   1.432/45 = 0.0318 feet or 0.382 inches per year. That is fast.

Bob