Co-champ baldcypress in MS   Jess Riddle
  Jul 29, 2007 13:06 PDT 

Gary,

A photograph of that new champion baldcypress appears in the 2006-2007
National Register of Big Trees. The tree has an exceptionally flared
base, even for a cypress. If you've ever played the board game Sorry,
the tree's trunk has much the same same as the pieces players move
around the board in that game. Sounds like the site Don knows about
probably has more impressive trees

Jess

On 7/6/07, gary-@bellsouth.net <gary-@bellsouth.net>; wrote:
 
I noticed on the big tree list at American Forests that there is now a
co-champ baldcypress, located in Holmes County, MS. It actually has a
greater circumference than the Cat Island, LA tree. It must be right at
17.5 feet dbh, with the other dimensions similiar to the Cat Island
tree. It might be another out-sized base, fast taper jobs. I'll have to
go see it.

Gary Smith
RE: Co-champ baldcypress in MS   gary-@bellsouth.net
  Jul 30, 2007 10:00 PDT 

Jess and ENTS,

I met Don up in Miss this past Saturday and we saw the co-champ cypress
in Holmes County. Your description of the tree is correct.
It is a nice tree and I'm glad to have seen it.

I really think AF needs to revisit their point system for trees such as
bald cypress that are subject to having buttressed bases. I've now seen
the Senator cypress in FL plus the co-champions in LA and Miss and to my
way of thinking, the Senator easily rules.

Sky Lake WMA is an intriguing area, with quite a few venerable, old
cypress war horses. We hope to go back at a later date and hope others
can join us.

I think Don will have a better report at a later date.

Gary

The big cypress of Mississippi   Don Bragg
  Jul 31, 2007 07:07 PDT 

ENTS--

On Saturday, Gary Smith and I met in the small town of Belzoni,
Mississippi, to hunt down some of the big baldcypress that this area is
known to have. We were both intrigued by the reports of massive
cypress, and we were both pleased and disappointed with what we found...

Our first stop was the new American Forests co-national champion
baldcypress just west of the Hillside National Wildlife Refuge in Holmes
County, MS. After a brief search of the local area trying to find the
right trail to take, we soon found ourselves looking into a small slough
surrounded by a stand of baldcypress, water tupelo, sugarberry,
sycamore, and some sweetgum. This stand ranges from fairly high and dry
to very wet, even during this drought year.

Natl_co_champ_Cypress1.jpg (144957 bytes) National Co-Champion Cypress.  
Note the "stump" underneath the root mass.


The champion cypress was easy to spot--having seen pictures of this
tree, we kind of knew what to expect... The tree makes their list as
co-champ because of a incredibly wide (even for baldcypress)
buttress--so much so, that I didn't even make an attempt at measuring
diameter. After this initial swell, which drops drastically at about 5
feet above the ground, the cypress proves to be of very modest size. It
reaches about 86 feet tall, but it has all the appearances of a young
tree (young, of course, being relative for cypress, which can live to
well over 1,000 years). To me, it seems that this cypress may have
gotten its start on the stump of an old dead cypress, and then was able
to cover it over with its own root system. I have definitely seen many
more impressive cypress than this tree, which was interesting to see,
but not massive at all.

SkyLakeSlough_cypress1.jpg (25630 bytes) Sky Lake Slough: 
the water visible is not actually part of Sky Lake itself, but some catfish 
rearing ponds located nearby--this image looks back towards a slough 
draining into Sky Lake.



We then traveled northwest of this site to Sky Lake Wildlife Management
Area in northern Humphreys County. We had heard good things about this
site--all true, by the way, unless the clouds of mosquitoes or
occasional cottonmouth are considered bad... Sky Lake WMA is a recently
protected area that is chock-full of giant and ancient baldcypress
(http://www.wildlifemiss.org/news/news/2001/05-16.html). We parked at
an old cemetery next to the WMA, from which the big cypress could be
seen towering over a low understory of water locust and what I think was
water-elm. We skirted the edge of the cemetery and some cropland before
dropping down off of the higher terrace into a wooded slough choked with
mosquitoes. This site was still fairly wet, even with the major drought
Mississippi is experiencing, so we slogged along as best we could,
regretting with every step that we left our boots behind.

SkyLakeCemetery_cypress1.jpg (51994 bytes) Sky Lake Cemetary

Large baldcypress boles soon started appearing amongst the low tangle of
hardwoods. We came across a number of nice-sized cypress, almost all of
them more massive than the co-champ we had seen earlier in the day.
Most were draped with Spanish moss, and it was obvious that they were
ancient. We stopped to measure only one cypress--it turned out to be
32.8 feet in circumference (I couldn't get a height on it due to the
conditions, but it probably wasn't much more than 80 or 90 feet tall).
This tree was huge and well worth the journey, but we weren't able to
find the real bigguns lurking in this swamp--there are at least a few
out here that go over 40 feet in circumference!! We vowed to return
later this year, when conditions are better, and we're better equipped.
After returning to the truck, we then drove around to several other
vantages points of Sky Lake and its associated sloughs. From several
points we could see large cypress standing out above the rest of the
trees--a sure sign of more big cypress reports to come!

We then headed over to the Delta National Forest, which lies southwest
of Belzoni. North of the small town of Holly Bluff, we crossed the
parched yet rich farmlands of the Mississippi River Delta to get to the
Sweetgum Research Natural Area. This is a small tract of timber that
had been spared from the logging of these bottomland hardwoods.
Historically, it had been dominated by large sweetgum, but unfortunately
many of these have died in recent decades. The stand still has a
scattering of large, old sweetgum, including one we measured to be 49.1
inches at DBH and at least 138 feet tall. Most of the rest of the
canopy oaks and gums aren't this tall--perhaps between 100 and 120 feet.
Still, the stand had a unique feel about it, with its cane and palmetto
dominated understory growing up out of the clayey, wet soil.

Sweetgum+GarySmith1.jpg (87658 bytes) Large Sweetgum and Gary Smith

After a quick walk through the Sweetgum RNA, Gary and I discussed future
plans to return to the Sky Lake WMA, and then parted ways. As I reached
the northern end of the Delta National Forest, a large woodpecker with a
prominent red crest darted from the big timber on one side of the road
to the other. My pulse quickened as my brain raced through woodpecker
characteristics... But alas, this was no ivory-bill, as its dark
plumage on its back showed--a male pileated woodpecker. Still, an
exciting way to conclude the day!

I'll send Ed some pictures from this adventure.

Don

****************************
Don Bragg, Ph.D.
Research forester
Editor, Bulletin of the ENTS
****************************

Re: The big cypress of Mississippi   Edward Frank
  Jul 31, 2007 16:32 PDT 

Don,

This really seems to be a problem of how the base of the tree is defined.
The actual base of the tree is atop the old stump if you use the "where the
acorn sprouted" definition offered by Colby Rucker. Therefore by this
definition its girth should be measured about five feet further up the tree.
That would be easy to apply consistently if the nurse logs and stumps
continued to persist forever. Eventually however they will decay and the
original position will be lost. If you define the base as the ground
surface beneath the log or stump, then you are actually measuring the girth
at a height that is lower by the thickness of the log or height of the stump
serving as a nurse log. We had a brief discussion of this in a series of
posts back in 2005:
http://www.nativetreesociety.org/measure/tree_base_position.htm Basically in
my opinion defining the base of the tree as the existing ground surface
supporting the tree would result in some oddball cases like this, but would
be workable overall without the need for interpretations of what was the
actual initial growing point for these trees sprouted on nurse logs.

Ed Frank
RE: The big cypress of Mississippi   James Smith
  Jul 31, 2007 19:18 PDT 

Nice to know that there are stands of big cypress trees still out there.
RE: The big cypress of Mississippi   Don Bragg
  Aug 01, 2007 05:31 PDT 

Ed--

Gary and I both agreed that while a very interesting tree that its
owners can be proud of (and they are, we met one at the tree), this
specimen does not rise to the ranks of a champion because of the
quirkiness of the base. I also agree that a different set of rules
should apply to these trees to avoid this problem.

I don't know for sure if the tree is growing on a large stump, but when
you get the pictures I sent, the one with Gary standing next to the tree
also clearly has a small "window" in the base that exposes decayed wood
that looked to me to be part of a stump...no way to confirm this without
closer examination, but it could explain the extremely swollen base.

Don Bragg
RE: The big cypress of Mississippi   wad-@comcast.net
  Aug 01, 2007 09:17 PDT 
Don, Ed, ENTS
(this is not a hostile comment, read as a relaxed discussion)
I don't think there is any way to level the playing field for how a tree got it's start. Most Hemlocks in old stands get there start on a nurse log. I saw similar starts for young trees (sweet gum, black gum, magnolia) in Bear swamp NJ. If a tree starts out on a 10'cbh fallen log as compared to a 1'cbh log, how can we possibly determine this 50, 100, 300 years down the road. The champion programs are not scientific, they are hobby based. The contest is based on bigness, not age, volume, or any other principle. I agree heights could be recorded more accurately and girths of multistemmed trees are sometimes mistakes, and I am glad I met all of you to make me better at getting the measurements right. I just don't think there is an effective way to even it all out. If that tree is growing over an old stump, so be it. Maybe the other bald cypress have too, just smaller ones. With all of that said, the cypress' that were reported on are big and beautiful. This is one of the re
asons I include several of each species in the Pennsylvania list, not just the biggest and those within ten points. A tree that is 20 points shy is still impressive to me.

Scott
RE: The big cypress of Mississippi   Will Blozan
  Aug 01, 2007 12:19 PDT 
ENTS,

I agree, the origin of a tree's base is not always possible to ascertain as
time goes on.

How do these cypress trees compare on the TDI system? I don't have the
current dimensions (or maxima). To settle this we need the ENTS measurements
of the "Senator" (I have girth and height; spread anyone?) and "The Turnip".
Does "The Turnip" represent the maximum girth known for baldcypress? The
tallest known is in Congaree NP. Anyone have a max spread for bald cypress?

Will
Measuring dilemmas  Willard Fell
 Aug 24, 2007 13:53 PDT 
Interesting discussion. I know much has been said about root flair
concerning Cypress and Tupelo, but many large trees that we come in
contact with for champion measurements have excessive root flair/butt
swell that perhaps skews the "actual" size of the tree. I have posted a
few that I have photos of with people next to them for reference that I
took last winter. The two oaks are on the books will the pine was just a
large one I saw with excessive butt swell, but not unheard of in
bottomland areas.



http://s15.photobucket.com/albums/a376/wfell/?action=view¤t=OakSRedUpson002.jpg

Southern Red Oak, Upson County GA



http://s15.photobucket.com/albums/a376/wfell/?action=view¤t=oakswchesthouston.jpg

Swamp Chestnut Oak, Houston County GA



http://s15.photobucket.com/albums/a376/wfell/?action=view¤t=FtStewartSlashB002.jpg

Slash Pine, Ft Stewart (Liberty County) GA



The following has nothing to do with flare, but presents an interesting
measurement question at DBH should it have been a contender. Came across
it at Ft Stewart last Jan with some of the post foresters while
measuring some other potential state champions on the army post.



http://s15.photobucket.com/albums/a376/wfell/?action=view¤t=FtStewartPostOak003.jpg

Unusual Post Oak, Ft Stewart GA



This is for you Bob....what we'll go through to get that big tree. Our
state champion Lob Pine is dead center of the impact area at Ft Stewart.



http://s15.photobucket.com/albums/a376/wfell/?action=view¤t=FtStewart002.jpg

Tree hit by artillery round.